President said in interview Office of the Director of National Intelligence should be ‘much smaller’ and maybe even terminated

President Trump said he wants Bill Pulte, his incoming acting director of national intelligence, to begin the process of firing a large number of employees as part of a shake-up of the U.S. intelligence community.

In an interview with The Wall Street Journal on Friday, Trump said he has privately told Pulte that he believes the Office of the Director of National Intelligence, or ODNI, which oversees 18 federal intelligence agencies and units, is “unnecessary and/or too big.”

“I’d like to see it smaller. I think there are a lot of people in there that shouldn’t be there,” Trump said, pointing to holdovers from the Biden and Obama administrations. Asked whether he is calling on Pulte to fire people, Trump said he wants him to “start the process,” adding that his eventual nominee to serve in the role permanently should continue that work.

Trump stunned many of his own advisers when he said earlier this week that he was appointing Pulte, the director of the Federal Housing Finance Agency, as his intelligence chief. The move was met with skepticism from some Republicans on Capitol Hill, who raised concerns about Pulte’s lack of national-security experience.

The president named Pulte director of national intelligence on an acting basis, a temporary role that doesn’t require Senate confirmation. He can serve in the role for 210 days.

Trump, in the interview, argued that Pulte’s acting status is an asset. “You’re less shackled,” he said. “It sort of gives you more power, you know, for a somewhat limited period of time.”

The president said he hopes Pulte can begin making changes across the intelligence community before a permanent intelligence director is confirmed.

“Frankly, it might be good for him to shake it up before people come,” Trump said. “Because, if he [Pulte] reduced the size, in conjunction with me…and in conjunction with possibly the person coming in…he can do a lot of the hard work and we wouldn’t have to saddle somebody that goes in.”

Pulte and representatives for the Office of the Director of National Intelligence didn’t respond to requests for comment.

Democrats and some Republicans have sounded alarms that Pulte, a close Trump ally, will use his perch to target the president’s perceived enemies and politicize the agency. “We don’t need a weaponized DNI,” Senate Majority Leader John Thune (R., S.D.) told reporters earlier this week.

The president said he is in the process of interviewing permanent intelligence-director candidates. He said he was interviewing two people on Friday, “one from business and one from the world of politics.” But he declined to name them. “Bill is not going to be there that long,” Trump said.

Meanwhile, Trump said he wants Pulte to approach the job similarly to the way Education Secretary Linda McMahon has managed her agency. McMahon has moved to reduce the size of the department, which Trump has previously said he wants to eliminate, and shift some of its duties to other agencies.

“We’ve made the Department of Education much smaller, and likewise, this should be much smaller,” Trump said, referring to ODNI. “And this should maybe even be terminated, and we’ll make that decision.”

Pulte said last year that Fannie Mae was firing more than 100 employees. The administration later fired about a dozen officials in Fannie Mae’s ethics and internal investigations unit. Pulte is the chairman of the board for both Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, which are overseen by the Federal Housing Finance Agency.

The director of national intelligence is the president’s top intelligence adviser. The DNI’s powers include briefing the president on the most sensitive U.S. secrets, exercising authority over the $100 billion annual U.S. spy budget and holding sway over which secrets to declassify.

The president said he wants Pulte to release more classified documents related to issues such as the 2020 election. Asked what kind of documents Pulte should consider releasing, Trump said, “I would say everything—he should look at everything and make a determination.”

In recent weeks, Pulte privately argued to Trump that he would be a good candidate to succeed Tulsi Gabbard as director of national intelligence, underscoring his loyalty to the president, the Journal previously reported. Gabbard said last month that she was stepping down.

ODNI is already in the process of making cuts. Gabbard said last year the agency would reduce spending by more than 40%, including by eliminating redundant personnel.

Some in the Trump administration have at times been frustrated with Pulte for bypassing the chain of command to get access to Trump.

Referred to by some as “Little Trump,” Pulte won the president’s confidence through his aggressive approach to his role as the administration’s housing chief. He alleged that several of Trump’s perceived foes committed mortgage fraud, including Sen. Adam Schiff (D., Calif.); Letitia James, the attorney general of New York; and Lisa Cook, a member of the Federal Reserve Board of Governors.

Trump pointed to Pulte’s allegations against Cook when he moved to fire her as Fed governor last year. Cook’s legal challenge is currently pending before the Supreme Court. Schiff and Cook weren’t charged with any crimes. All have denied wrongdoing.

Pulte also bolstered Trump’s campaign against the Fed’s then-chair, Jerome Powell, calling for his ouster on social media and drafting a letter for Trump to fire Powell.